Dr. Tim Clinton: Welcome in to Family Talk, the broadcast division of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute. I'm Dr. Tim Clinton, co-host of Family Talk.
As a licensed professional counselor and marriage and family therapist, I'm honored to serve as resident authority on mental health and relationships here at JDFI. I also serve as president of the American Association of Christian Counselors, and executive director of the Liberty University Global Center on Mental Health Addiction and Recovery. Thank you for joining us.
Today's guest is also a Liberty University graduate and has had quite an amazing career in Washington, D.C., advocating for children on Capitol Hill, and is now serving as the CEO and president of Concerned Women for America, Penny Young Nance. Penny was a legislative director for Concerned Women for America. Early in her career, Penny founded and was president of Kids First Coalition, a nonprofit organization focused on educating people about a range of issues that children face. Then she became a special advisor for the Federal Communications Commissions, the FCC, where she focused on the protection of children in the broadcast industry and served on the media taskforce fighting youth obesity.
Penny Young Nance then notably served on President Trump's Life Advisory Council. She spoke often to the president, vice president, as well as key staff as the voice of Christian conservative women of faith. To then, it was after that that she became the CEO and president of Concerned Women for America.
You may have seen her speaking on a national news program or read an article in the New York Times, Wall Street Journal, or the Washington Post that she wrote. Penny is married to Will. Together, they have two children.
Penny, it's so great to have you here on Family Talk. Dr. Dobson, his wife, Shirley, send their regards, and they so admire and respect the work that you're doing with Concerned Women for America.
Penny Young Nance: Well, it is a great honor to be on with you, Tim, and of course, I am a huge fan of Dr. and Shirley Dobson, and I'm just honored to get to be on anything that is connected to the both of them. They're just stalwarts in the faith and heroes of mine, frankly.
Dr. Tim Clinton: Penny, everybody's in Washington. I know you're there. Are you going to be marching on the square this morning?
Penny Young Nance: Yes, I will be at the March for Life with several hundred thousand of my closest friends and CWA leaders, our Young Women for America leaders in a cold January, as usual. But we have to always show up and speak for life, Tim.
Dr. Tim Clinton: You know what's exciting to me too, Penny, is how young the faces are at the March for Life.
Penny Young Nance: Yes, isn't that so exciting? Because you've got a whole generation, now a couple of generations, of young people who all own their own sonogram picture. You can't lie to them and tell them that it's not a life in utero or it's a clump of cells. They know. They recognize their own faces, right? Inside the womb. So yes, it is a very young crowd. And also, I think that sense of justice. They understand that abortion is violence in the womb and is unjust, and they want to speak up.
Dr. Tim Clinton: We were talking about Concerned Women for America and the work through the years. Penny, it goes all the way back to Beverly LaHaye, good friends of the Dobsons through the years. And it's just amazing how God has protected and continued to strengthen that voice for CWA. You are at the helm of that organization. Penny, tell us a little bit about what's happening and what our listeners could be praying about.
Penny Young Nance: Thank you. Well, we are at a tipping point in our country, Dr. Clinton. I think that people around this country feel it acutely as we watch just this unraveling that's happened since the election of President Biden just so quickly. But of course, we know that behind the scenes, it hasn't been quick. It's actually been growing. But Concerned Women for America, as you noted, has been active and working on behalf of the unique dignity of women since 1979. But we're seeing this moment in which maybe more than ever before, the voices of Christian women is essential. It's crucial in this moment.
We have over 185 Young Women for America collegiate chapters, and they are so excited and strong on the issue, both of life, but also standing up for the rights of women, the unique dignity of women as their rights are being taken away on sports field and locker rooms across America, and classrooms. So they are stepping forth in their Esther moment.
So I'm just honored to get to work as their spokeswoman. And of course, our CWA leaders, over 400 trained leaders around this country that are active, both local, state, federal level, as grassroots activists, as women of faith who are speaking up on behalf of the least of these.
Dr. Tim Clinton: Everybody's turning the dial up, Penny. I can tell it already. And in the midst of it, I think of... My mind went back, while you were talking, to Loudoun County, Virginia, when that whole fiasco went down up there about kids and the whole gender ideology stuff being forced on our kids. It's not education, it's indoctrination that's going on.
Penny Young Nance: That's right.
Dr. Tim Clinton: And the parents up there, primarily the mama bears, had had enough and they said, "We're drawing a line in the sand. This is over. We're not going to do this anymore. Not here, not in our state."
Penny Young Nance: That's right.
Dr. Tim Clinton: And I'll tell you what, Penny, it moved the dial in the state of Virginia in a big way. And by the way, it shook the nation because people began to see something happening. Penny, I grew up with five sisters and a mother who was very strong, and I know this, when women get to praying and when they get fired up, things start happening. Where I grew up, we would say it this way, it puts the dogs up under the bed, if you know what I mean.
Penny, when you think about women mobilizing, we know the majority of women who attend church actually are active in their church. Not so much so for men. Penny, what's your prayer? What are you hoping? What are you praying for? You've been doing this for a long time. Is that dial moving? Are you seeing that kind of energy really erupt?
Penny Young Nance: Well, you said it. We saw in the purple state of Virginia, the election of a Republican governor, Glenn Youngkin, for the first time in, I don't know, what, almost a decade. And it has been a game changer in my... Virginia's my home state. And we are going to see more of that. I think a lot of what we've seen, Governor DeSantis in Florida won by 19 points, right?
I think it is interesting, and the Republican party needs to be aware of when you lead with principles and with parents' rights and with the issue of life, instead of hiding from those issues, you win. It is the winning issue of our day because parents have had it. And you're right, Christian women have had it.
My prayer is that even more of us wake up and come to Concerned Women for America and other like-minded groups so that we can train you and that you can step forward and lead. No more looking at our shoes when the hard topics come up, because our children are depending on us taking leadership. And it should never be because you don't know what to say, because we have the resources. We will train you. If you feel led by the Lord to speak into the hard topics of the day, sign up for our information at concernedwomen.org, and we will train you to lead in these issues. But we can't be silent anymore, and I think we're at this moment where American women feel it even more acutely than we did before.
Dr. Tim Clinton: Well, one of the things that happened that I think shocked the world was last June when the Dobbs case went down in the Supreme Court-
Penny Young Nance: That's right.
Dr. Tim Clinton: ... and Roe was overturned. Here we are, March for Life. Penny, tell us a little bit about your thoughts on the pro-life movement. I mean, people would say, "We're winning. We're winning." But the fight goes on. There's a lot more to do.
Penny Young Nance: That's right. Well, the left actually thinks they have us on the rails because the Republicans didn't dominate in the last election. But they did win the House. And what we're seeing is Speaker McCarthy and Majority Leader Steve Scalise, and many of you all remember him as a great Christian brother who was shot at the Congressional Baseball Game. He's our majority leader now.
So there are actually three key pieces of legislation that they're coming out of the gate on. It's No Taxpayer Funding for Abortion and clarity in insurance, so you know if your insurance pays for abortion. A sense of the House that says... And can you believe that we're having to do a sense of the House that says that you cannot, you should not reign violence on pro-life groups like Concerned Women for America. We were targeted. And also on other key issues.
One of the key issues that CWA is working on is life.gov. This is a very simple piece of legislation that Nancy Mace in the House has actually introduced and Marco Rubio in the Senate. And I don't know why we didn't think of it before. We were sitting around, saying, "We need one place where a woman in need can go and find out all of her different options," because we know there's many, many alternatives, many that are funding by our tax dollars that people don't even know about. Support for housing, support for education, healthcare, issues for adoption, foster care, all the things that a woman needs in order to choose life.
We're working now to pass a piece of legislation that it will be under one umbrella, through HHS, where we can find out all the alternatives for a woman in California from her zip code. Or a woman in Tennessee or Virginia, no matter where she is, she can find out what's at her disposal.
And then it helps people like us, Tim, know where the holes are. Where do we need to give them more support? When we have it all in one place and managed well, then we can really know what else needs to be done.
But there's many other important things to be done. Yes, the March for Life, we've got to keep on marching. Concerned Women for America led. On December 1st of last year, we had 2,000 women in front of the Supreme Court, rallying on behalf of life. And then we stood there again. I got to stand there the day of June 24th. My picture joined other great leaders on the front of the New York Times, and my husband blew up that picture for me so I could always have it and our children and grandchildren can have it. We overturned Roe as a movement, as Christian people. 50 years worth of prayer, we did it.
But understand it's just the beginning of the fight. We now are having a state by state pitched battle. We have 22 states that are mostly pro-life, and six of those states, their laws are enjoined in the court. So we're having to battle, battle, battle. But we must take the fight to every single state. And that means that all of us have to be involved. And Concerned Women for America's active at every state and we need all the help that we can get. Come to the fight.
Dr. Tim Clinton: Well, I'm sitting back, listening and thinking to myself, it's because of the faithfulness of those who would dare to go against the grain and say, "No, we're not doing that. We're going to overturn Roe." And it's breathtaking to think about that actually happening in our lifetime. Again, a credit to this kind of work and effort.
Penny, when you say the fight goes on, I think you're so right. It's staggering to me to think that we're in a post-Roe era right now, but you have some states who have, quote, "become sanctuary type states."
Penny Young Nance: That's right.
Dr. Tim Clinton: And they're even talking about abortion all the way up to birth.
Penny Young Nance: Birth. That's right.
Dr. Tim Clinton: To birth.
Penny Young Nance: That's right.
Dr. Tim Clinton: And-
Penny Young Nance: That's what they want.
Dr. Tim Clinton: It's insanity to think this, that 7 out of 10 or so Americans want some type of restriction, but there are states out there that are doing this, and how we've got to continue to keep our hands to the plow.
Penny Young Nance: That's right. States like New York and California, sadly the day after, on June 25th, nothing had changed for them. In fact, they went even harder to the left. But the answer to that, and people's like, "What are we going to do about California?" Well, the answer is the churches. The answer is the pastors. And pastors have to not be afraid to speak into these issues. I think young pastors in particular need to be encouraged and supported as they speak into these matters. I've had pastors say to me, "Penny, how can we support you?" And what I say is preach the Bible. Preach all of it, every single bit of it, even the parts that make you squirm. Even the parts that maybe make someone walk out of your church and say mean things about you in the paper the next day. This is what you're called to do as the watchmen on the wall.
And we, as women of faith, need to encourage our pastors and our leaders to step forward, and we have to hold their arms up. And as women, we have a unique place, a unique moment of leadership and dignity in which we can lead on this issue. And we must lead because messenger matters. Women are the life-bringers of this world. This is how God made us. There's only two sexes. There's men and women, and only women can give birth. Let me just say. I know what a woman is. Sadly, not all of our Supreme Court justices do. But we need to speak into those moments and we cannot be tamped down, bullied, quieted. We must speak truth.
Dr. Tim Clinton: You're listening to Family Talk, a division of the James Dobson Family Institute. I'm Dr. Tim Clinton, co-host. And our special guest, Penny Nance. She is the CEO, president of Concerned Women for America, an organization that God's using in a mighty way to help stir the hearts of women all across this land to stand bold for truth and to be courageous for such a time as this.
Penny, I want to come back. You mentioned the whole issue of women and understanding our sexes, but let's go to the NCAA and what's happening there and this whole issue of, really, disrespect, if you will, for women in sports.
Penny Young Nance: Well, and our Young Women for America leaders are fiery mad about this. I mean, think about it. You're a young woman who has spent most of your high school career working so hard, giving up some of the other fun things on the weekend that your friends did so you can be in bed early and be at the track or the pool first thing. Their mothers are the ones that were up at 0 dark 30, driving them to swim practice. And they show up one day at the meet and who are they competing against, but a biological male. And then when they dare complain, they're told to be quiet, that they're bigots, and they aren't even allowed to complain, and they're being told that by their schools.
And then further, when the young man, who, by the way, still dates women, as in the case of Lia Thomas, comes into their locker room, they're told that they're not allowed to complain. Nevermind Title IX and nevermind all the work we've done on the Me Too movement, that somehow they have to push down that feeling in their gut, where they know that something's wrong and they feel uncomfortable and they feel afraid.
There is something ridiculous and wrong about a whole society who's turned on American women, and we're not having it. So right now, we have our young women who the NCAA has been meeting. They're active. And by the way, on the day that Lia Thomas won the NCAA Championship Division I in swimming, our young women were rallying and protesting outside that swim meet at Georgia Tech. And it was our Young Women for America leaders that were quoted in the media. Concerned Women for America filed a civil lawsuit against University of Pennsylvania because they are discriminating against women, the other women in the pool.
So all of that's getting worked out. There's much to do. I truly believe this will end up in the Supreme Court, Tim, probably within if not this term, maybe next term, because it is something that we will not back down from. ADF is working alongside us, and we must protect the rights and the safety and dignity of women. And they are leading in the issue, and that's how you win.
Dr. Tim Clinton: Penny, I wanted to ask you this because I often get pushed a little bit and a lot of conversation shows up on social media about compassion. They weaponize, if you will, empathy in this whole situation and say you're a hater. You don't care about their feelings or what have you. Penny, how do you go about encouraging parents and others to, quote, "stand strong" to say, "Listen, that kind of gender ideology has no place in an elementary school." You know what I'm saying?
Penny Young Nance: Mm-hmm. Yeah, that's right.
Dr. Tim Clinton: And when you come to sports, and you just explained it so incredibly well, I mean, it's just frustrating. And at the same time, you're right. You're not allowed to have a voice back. We want to have the love and care of Christ, but hey, bottom line, how do we come with a reasoned truth here for a moment?
Penny Young Nance: Well, and understand this is not biblical worldview. This is taken from enlightenment, right? The philosophy. The radical majority. Truth is what we say it is, right? It's not reality. It's not God's truth. It's not absolute truth. It's whatever we say it is. So we've got this philosophical lie that whatever you say you are, however you identify, not just whether it's man or woman, it could also be a fox, a dog, a cat. I mean, this is how far we've come. It's not just transgender, it's trans-species that we're starting to see show up in the school system.
Dr. Tim Clinton: I know.
Penny Young Nance: So we must, in love, tell the truth. It is not loving to allow a lie to stand and to go along with it. The emperor has no clothes. You can't just pretend.
And here's the other side of it. There's other victims. A young woman is victimized when her trophy, her scholarship, her position is taken because a biological man wants it. I feel like the left thinks men are better at everything, including being women. I mean, it is just outrageous what they're allowed to get away with. And I'm sorry, it's not loving for me to allow them to injure young women.
We saw Victoria's Secret just fired their CEO because she had men on the runway wearing women's lingerie. And oddly, women didn't want to go buy it then. I mean, we have lost our minds. And people have to tell the truth. And you can do it without being mean about it. And you can say, "I love you."
Listen, I feel so sad for the mom and dad and that little kid who's suffering, but I have to start wondering, when I see parents who are enjoying it a little too much, they're starting to make it part of their persona. "I've got a trans kid." Nevermind the kid's five and he or she might change her mind if you just give her a little bit of time. Now we're starting to talk about surgery, pediatric surgery, Tim, to harm, to do a mastectomy, to do castration for underage children. Are you joking? There's nothing kind and compassionate about that. It's outrageous and it's wrong. And if you love-
Dr. Tim Clinton: And Penny, there's no research.
Penny Young Nance: ... your neighbor, if you love your neighbor, you'll stand up and say that. That's real love. Because that kid, one day, is going to wake up... And we're already starting to see the de-transition movement, right? We're starting to see young people whose voices will never come back, who are made sterile because of what's happened to them, because of the drugs. You can't just pause and come back and be no problem. I mean, many women have stories about how chemical hormones maybe changed or hurt their bodies. So certainly children do.
So we have got to really stand up as a church. It is loving to tell the truth. It is loving to be caring and to protect other people. The radical majority cannot rule the roost and hurt an entire group of young women. And we just stand by and shrug our shoulders? No, we're not going to do it. We won't do it.
Dr. Tim Clinton: Penny, a lot of women listening probably are saying, "Hey, I want to learn more about Concerned Women for America." Where do they go? What do they do?
Penny Young Nance: Well, we would love for them to come follow us on social media and also Penny Nance on social media. We have Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, the whole gambit. Truth, you name it. But also come to concernedwomen.org and sign up for our weekly reports so you can know exactly what's happening in Washington and be kept apprised of the issues that matter most to you and your family.
Dr. Tim Clinton: Penny, what an amazing work you're doing in and through CWA, Concerned Women for America. I was thinking here again, we're circling all the way back, March for Life week today. I know you're busy speaking all over. We're there. We're coming out with everything. We've got to challenge people to stand strong, to hold the line. When you think of CVS and Walgreens and others-
Penny Young Nance: That's right.
Dr. Tim Clinton: ... being a platform to, quote, "distribute the abortion pill" and more, we've got a lot of work to do. God help us.
Penny Young Nance: Yes, a perfect example. Find other... I mean, I have to do it too. We have to find other pharmacies that are not using our money and selling the abortion drug to young women. I mean, this is a direct assault on our beliefs and we've got to vote with our purse, and it matters. It makes a huge difference. So it's every day, every one of us doing what we can do, praying, looking for opportunities to support the people that support our values, and making good decisions on behalf of our family and speaking up.
Dr. Tim Clinton: Well, Penny, we can't wait. I hope to see you there in the march, and we're going to be posting on social media all day long. So hey, let's just pray that God does something that only He can get the glory for.
Penny Young Nance Amen. We'll look for you, brother, and see you at the march.
Roger Marsh: Wow, Penny Young Nance is such a positive force for defending conservative rights and articulating the concerns of our nation's most precious resources, the girls, young women, ladies, and moms of America. You can hear it in Penny's voice. She is on fire to be an advocate for God's word, biblical truth, and a biblical worldview.
You've been listening to Family Talk, and as you know, there are still many causes that we need to stand together for men and women alike, like fighting for the pre-born. Just a reminder that today is the 50th annual March for Life in Washington, D.C.. Our production team is there, so you can look forward to hearing new content coming soon, taken from the events of this pro-life weekend.
And also a reminder that this Sunday is Sanctity of Life Sunday. I hope your church and pastor will be leading your congregation in prayer to defend the pre-born. Make sure that happens, if you can.
Okay, as we wrap up another week here on the broadcast, a few housekeeping reminders for you. If you enjoy listening to Family Talk, you'll surely appreciate receiving our 2022 Best of Broadcast Collection. You can get your very own six CD set of our most popular programs from 2022 as a thanks for a suggested donation of $50. Simply visit our website at drjamesdobson.org. Remember, you can also order by phone. The number to call is 877-732-6825. That's 877-732-6825.
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Announcer: This has been a presentation of the Dr. James Dobson Family Institute.